Plus: Facial recognition arrests at Notting Hill Carnival, TfL tries to convince people to use headphones, and the London cricket team bought by a family with 900 crocodiles.
My theory on the phone/music thing is there are both more sounds to listen to, and the way that those sounds are encountered. Eg, in the old days you'd plug your headphones into your iPod, press play and essentially ignore your iPod for a while.
On phones, however, we're constantly encountering new videos on social feeds, voice notes etc – and so if you're scrolling without headphones and encounter something you want to watch, then you're faced with faffing around mid-journey pulling out headphones for a thirty second clip/one song/etc, or just pressing play and listening on the speaker that's right there.
People have forgotten a lot of what is acceptable on public transport in general. The number of times I've been hit by someone's backpack on a full tube has gone up drastically in recent years.
There used to be signs to take backpacks in your hand or leave them on the floor, these have disappeared in the last years and now a number of people just don't "get it".
One can only hope that TFL puts signs up for everything that is not acceptable, including phones/tablets on speaker. Maybe people will feel a bit more empowered to ask the infringers to stop.
My daughter lived for a while in Freetown, Sierra Leone. She decided that while people in Britain tend to think in terms of a right to silence (which is infringed by the making of noise), there people thought in terms of a right to make noise (which the imposition of quiet would infringe).
Last time I asked someone in the quiet carriage on SW Trains to stop talking loudly on her phone, not only did she act as if I was infringing her rights, the (quiet) people around her did too.
I do think immigration is a plausible factor in this (though not the only one). London's receptiveness to migration is one of its superpowers, but it seems possible to me that one result is lots of people moving to London from other cultures where playing loud music in public is considered normal, and carrying on that behaviour without thinking (any Brit who's eaten on the Japanese metro can testify to how easily that's done).
This is why I'm optimistic the new signs will have some impact, though they obviously won't solve the problem entirely. A lot of people just don't know they're doing something wrong!
Once I travelled with one of my best friends by high speed train from Paris to the south of France. We hadn't seen each other for a while; we talked and laughed. A French couple on the other side of the aisle hushed us: "This is a quiet carriage". We felt frustration (I still do, thinking about it) - but we quietened.
Parallels Alex's Japan example. This is a spectrum on which we all find ourselves at different points.
However, it isn't symmetrical. The quiets need something from the noisies (to be less so); the noisies need nothing from the quiets (except their acquiescence). Public bodies looking to create the right balance need to speak up for the quiets.
That's interesting. I used to think London was noisy until I visited Vietnam for the first time, earlier this year. Everything there is LOUD. No one uses headphones on public transport, bars think nothing of blasting loud music late at night and the constant roar of motorcycles and scooters is deafening. It made me realise that London is actually quite calm and peaceful in comparison!
Re: headphone-less noise in public: I've always seen this blamed on the pandemic and the general breakdown of social norms it caused. Something that _feels_ correct but one I'd love to see backed up by reporting.
I definitely remember it happening before the pandemic - it wasn’t that long ago, after all - but it’s either since become more widespread or we notice it more because of being locked down away from other people for so long. But I don’t think the pandemic is entirely to blame; people don’t just lose a lifetime’s socialisation in a couple of years. I think it’s also got something to do with newer models of phones not having headphone sockets, and wireless ones being a bit of a pain, plus social media pushing everyone to think they’re the main character and other people don’t really matter or even exist in a meaningful sense. It would be really interesting to see some research on this and I would love to know from people who do this, why they do it!
Malt loaf used to always get picked up by the old x-ray scanners - a big blob of something fairly dense. You can see why wet wipes might look like explosives...
It's a shame no one is really talking about the Met's hugely successful Notting Hill Carnival pre-arrest operation. It meant the festival was largely peaceful after it had been marred with violence for years. I think the reason it has received so little analysis/praise is because most people are just too ideologically driven to admit *both* a) the carnival was a huge success this year and b) it was successful largely because of a very aggressive police operation.
Unfortunately it seems to be another thing coming from the pandemic. Since people have returned to public transport after a couple of years of being by themselves, a fair few have changed attitudes in how they act in public and often dont even notice they're being a pain.
If asked, almost all the time they do have headphones or earphones but they simply havent thought about connecting them up instead preferring the easier option that they were used to when at home alone.
Same with aggression being worse since the pandemic etc.
Even at home it’s possible to just use headphones instead of blasting music all over your block of flats or neighbourhood - looking at you, person down the road who puts a speaker in their open front window even though they’re indoors! Some people are just mindless
I’ve been out today mourning the loss of so much of Woolwich Common. It’s owned by the MoD who completely neglect their responsibilities for this unique space in urban London and leave clearing up the litter, mess and discarded tents, as well as fly tipping to The Friends of Woolwich Common.
Pretty much every wildfire is started either by vandalism or by discarded cigarettes, BBQs or glass bottles. In addition to this, illegal camping and groups of men seeking out almost hidden spots at the end of desire lines for drinking sessions are the guilty ones.
This Common has always been an almost wild space especially on its southern section and its home to over 300 plants in a wide diversity of habitats.
It is no coincidence that every time there is a fire, it’s the school summer holidays or Bank Holiday.
It’s surely not beyond the wit of those who are responsible for places at risk of fire to patrol the spaces and be a visible presence to those who have malign intent as well as ensuring that litter and BBQs, tents and cigarettes are swiftly removed and the culprits caught and punished.
When I asked someone to use headphones he likened me speaking with him in public to him punching me in public. And the TfL staff member stood there did nothing. So I'm not sure they're going to do much.
I was in Germany on a train recently, and a tourist was playing TikTok videos out of her phone. As soon as the train guard saw it, they put a politely put and end to it.
It would be nice if TfL staff made dealing with it a similar priority (even if announcements are more likely than actual enforcement).
I find a lot of people are completely incapable of interacting in person unless the encounter has been planned. They either clam up or get aggressive! Online you have all the time in the world to craft a reply; not so much in the real world when someone you don’t know is actually, oh horror!, *speaking to you*. I reckon a lot of people have lost, or never developed, the ability to just talk to/listen to people, especially strangers.
My headphone discourse (i left it in r/london many times) is that the relationship with media has changed a lot. It is not only that wireless headphones need charging (I grasp my Xperia 1 V with love and hope it lasts many years with its headphone jack and microsd slot) but listening without headphones, in general, has become normalised, with ipads being the greatest offenders of these. But also 20 years ago the relationship with media was music you owned or you wanted, and paid attention to, in a fairly limited storage, and now it's all content that need to be public and shared in general.
I find the relationship with society in general (where main character syndrome seems to be everywhere) an interesting parallel with the changes in social media in internet: previously you used forums, chats and similar with the end of meeting these people in real life, and that does not happen anymore.
---
Not much to say on other topics, maybe on the wildfires one: I fear the bbqs on these warm days and I call for their ban as they are in Spain.
Unless individuals recognise why consideration matters, and choose to act on it, public transport will continue to reflect a growing indifference to the comfort and respect of others. TFL can put up as many slick Shoreditch PR posters all they want, they know themselves it won't help.
I'm not sure the small patches of mixed grass / wildflowers in London meet the definition of rewilding - certainly not the ones I see in Bromley. Not been to Hyde Park for a while, but will be on the lookout next time:
Here we go: Royal Parks "like to describe it as enhancing our parks for wildlife" and they still maintain these areas with "Traditional meadow management techniques such as scything and harrowing".
As a regular train user in and around London, I've seen both young and old being guilty of loud music and video clips on phone speakers. I get the argument that trains are a public space but I still think there should be some consideration for fellow passengers - headphones are not expensive and not hard to buy. Regardless of the offender's age, a little more self-awareness would go an awful long way!
I have no time for any argument that it's acceptable behaviour. There are hundreds of people in train carriages at peak times, what on earth would it sound like if everyone was so selfish and blasting out their own music?
The only fair rule is a consistent one: no noise out of phone speakers.
My theory on the phone/music thing is there are both more sounds to listen to, and the way that those sounds are encountered. Eg, in the old days you'd plug your headphones into your iPod, press play and essentially ignore your iPod for a while.
On phones, however, we're constantly encountering new videos on social feeds, voice notes etc – and so if you're scrolling without headphones and encounter something you want to watch, then you're faced with faffing around mid-journey pulling out headphones for a thirty second clip/one song/etc, or just pressing play and listening on the speaker that's right there.
People have forgotten a lot of what is acceptable on public transport in general. The number of times I've been hit by someone's backpack on a full tube has gone up drastically in recent years.
There used to be signs to take backpacks in your hand or leave them on the floor, these have disappeared in the last years and now a number of people just don't "get it".
One can only hope that TFL puts signs up for everything that is not acceptable, including phones/tablets on speaker. Maybe people will feel a bit more empowered to ask the infringers to stop.
Try being a small woman! It’s even worse then, aggravated when they say ‘Oh, I didn’t see you’.
My daughter lived for a while in Freetown, Sierra Leone. She decided that while people in Britain tend to think in terms of a right to silence (which is infringed by the making of noise), there people thought in terms of a right to make noise (which the imposition of quiet would infringe).
Last time I asked someone in the quiet carriage on SW Trains to stop talking loudly on her phone, not only did she act as if I was infringing her rights, the (quiet) people around her did too.
I do think immigration is a plausible factor in this (though not the only one). London's receptiveness to migration is one of its superpowers, but it seems possible to me that one result is lots of people moving to London from other cultures where playing loud music in public is considered normal, and carrying on that behaviour without thinking (any Brit who's eaten on the Japanese metro can testify to how easily that's done).
This is why I'm optimistic the new signs will have some impact, though they obviously won't solve the problem entirely. A lot of people just don't know they're doing something wrong!
Once I travelled with one of my best friends by high speed train from Paris to the south of France. We hadn't seen each other for a while; we talked and laughed. A French couple on the other side of the aisle hushed us: "This is a quiet carriage". We felt frustration (I still do, thinking about it) - but we quietened.
Parallels Alex's Japan example. This is a spectrum on which we all find ourselves at different points.
However, it isn't symmetrical. The quiets need something from the noisies (to be less so); the noisies need nothing from the quiets (except their acquiescence). Public bodies looking to create the right balance need to speak up for the quiets.
That's interesting. I used to think London was noisy until I visited Vietnam for the first time, earlier this year. Everything there is LOUD. No one uses headphones on public transport, bars think nothing of blasting loud music late at night and the constant roar of motorcycles and scooters is deafening. It made me realise that London is actually quite calm and peaceful in comparison!
Re: headphone-less noise in public: I've always seen this blamed on the pandemic and the general breakdown of social norms it caused. Something that _feels_ correct but one I'd love to see backed up by reporting.
I definitely remember it happening before the pandemic - it wasn’t that long ago, after all - but it’s either since become more widespread or we notice it more because of being locked down away from other people for so long. But I don’t think the pandemic is entirely to blame; people don’t just lose a lifetime’s socialisation in a couple of years. I think it’s also got something to do with newer models of phones not having headphone sockets, and wireless ones being a bit of a pain, plus social media pushing everyone to think they’re the main character and other people don’t really matter or even exist in a meaningful sense. It would be really interesting to see some research on this and I would love to know from people who do this, why they do it!
Malt loaf used to always get picked up by the old x-ray scanners - a big blob of something fairly dense. You can see why wet wipes might look like explosives...
It's a shame no one is really talking about the Met's hugely successful Notting Hill Carnival pre-arrest operation. It meant the festival was largely peaceful after it had been marred with violence for years. I think the reason it has received so little analysis/praise is because most people are just too ideologically driven to admit *both* a) the carnival was a huge success this year and b) it was successful largely because of a very aggressive police operation.
Unfortunately it seems to be another thing coming from the pandemic. Since people have returned to public transport after a couple of years of being by themselves, a fair few have changed attitudes in how they act in public and often dont even notice they're being a pain.
If asked, almost all the time they do have headphones or earphones but they simply havent thought about connecting them up instead preferring the easier option that they were used to when at home alone.
Same with aggression being worse since the pandemic etc.
Even at home it’s possible to just use headphones instead of blasting music all over your block of flats or neighbourhood - looking at you, person down the road who puts a speaker in their open front window even though they’re indoors! Some people are just mindless
I’ve been out today mourning the loss of so much of Woolwich Common. It’s owned by the MoD who completely neglect their responsibilities for this unique space in urban London and leave clearing up the litter, mess and discarded tents, as well as fly tipping to The Friends of Woolwich Common.
Pretty much every wildfire is started either by vandalism or by discarded cigarettes, BBQs or glass bottles. In addition to this, illegal camping and groups of men seeking out almost hidden spots at the end of desire lines for drinking sessions are the guilty ones.
This Common has always been an almost wild space especially on its southern section and its home to over 300 plants in a wide diversity of habitats.
It is no coincidence that every time there is a fire, it’s the school summer holidays or Bank Holiday.
It’s surely not beyond the wit of those who are responsible for places at risk of fire to patrol the spaces and be a visible presence to those who have malign intent as well as ensuring that litter and BBQs, tents and cigarettes are swiftly removed and the culprits caught and punished.
It shouldn’t be left to volunteers every time.
When I asked someone to use headphones he likened me speaking with him in public to him punching me in public. And the TfL staff member stood there did nothing. So I'm not sure they're going to do much.
I was in Germany on a train recently, and a tourist was playing TikTok videos out of her phone. As soon as the train guard saw it, they put a politely put and end to it.
It would be nice if TfL staff made dealing with it a similar priority (even if announcements are more likely than actual enforcement).
I find a lot of people are completely incapable of interacting in person unless the encounter has been planned. They either clam up or get aggressive! Online you have all the time in the world to craft a reply; not so much in the real world when someone you don’t know is actually, oh horror!, *speaking to you*. I reckon a lot of people have lost, or never developed, the ability to just talk to/listen to people, especially strangers.
Great call for engagement!
My headphone discourse (i left it in r/london many times) is that the relationship with media has changed a lot. It is not only that wireless headphones need charging (I grasp my Xperia 1 V with love and hope it lasts many years with its headphone jack and microsd slot) but listening without headphones, in general, has become normalised, with ipads being the greatest offenders of these. But also 20 years ago the relationship with media was music you owned or you wanted, and paid attention to, in a fairly limited storage, and now it's all content that need to be public and shared in general.
I find the relationship with society in general (where main character syndrome seems to be everywhere) an interesting parallel with the changes in social media in internet: previously you used forums, chats and similar with the end of meeting these people in real life, and that does not happen anymore.
---
Not much to say on other topics, maybe on the wildfires one: I fear the bbqs on these warm days and I call for their ban as they are in Spain.
Unless individuals recognise why consideration matters, and choose to act on it, public transport will continue to reflect a growing indifference to the comfort and respect of others. TFL can put up as many slick Shoreditch PR posters all they want, they know themselves it won't help.
Good write up on wildflowers and fire risk here. In short with some basic management the risk is very low:
https://petersfieldsociety.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/Wildflower-meadows-and-wildfires-June-2023.pdf
I'm not sure the small patches of mixed grass / wildflowers in London meet the definition of rewilding - certainly not the ones I see in Bromley. Not been to Hyde Park for a while, but will be on the lookout next time:
https://www.rewildingbritain.org.uk/why-rewild/what-is-rewilding/an-introduction-to-rewilding/defining-rewilding
"At Rewilding Britain, we define rewilding as the large-scale restoration of ecosystems to the point where nature is allowed to take care of itself."
That's not what London councils state they are going for. They still maintain the space - or should do.
Here we go: Royal Parks "like to describe it as enhancing our parks for wildlife" and they still maintain these areas with "Traditional meadow management techniques such as scything and harrowing".
https://www.royalparks.org.uk/read-watch-listen/wild-spaces-nature-people
As a regular train user in and around London, I've seen both young and old being guilty of loud music and video clips on phone speakers. I get the argument that trains are a public space but I still think there should be some consideration for fellow passengers - headphones are not expensive and not hard to buy. Regardless of the offender's age, a little more self-awareness would go an awful long way!
I have no time for any argument that it's acceptable behaviour. There are hundreds of people in train carriages at peak times, what on earth would it sound like if everyone was so selfish and blasting out their own music?
The only fair rule is a consistent one: no noise out of phone speakers.